FantasySharks.com

There are two types of Fantasy Football Owners: Sharks and Chum, which are you?
It is currently Wed 08.27.2014, 09:53

All times are UTC - 5 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 70 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 14:29 
Offline
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Sat 05.16.2009, 09:57
Posts: 27848
Sand$: 33236
Donate
Location: Arkansas
mia.gif
hard 10 wrote:
Simpson could develop into a good complementary receiver opposite Green, but he doesn't look like anything special.

I'm not calling Carolina's receivers great, just disagreeing that the Bengals pass-catchers should be considered a strength of the team.


Fair enough...not as though you can call them a weakness though. Strength may have been too strong a word. They're certainly serviceable.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 14:30 
Online
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Tue 09.06.2005, 07:51
Posts: 29566
Sand$: 115080
Donate
Location: where the red furn grows
min.gif
Elmagister wrote:
birddog wrote:
Elmagister wrote:
His former #1 is really doing a bang up job in NE.
former.. kind of a key word here. Hes a Rookie.. there is no 'his former' ..Didn't even have the opportunity to play with the guy that lead his team in receiving 7 of the past 9yrs. Like Newton having Smitty.. 'the best WR pound for pound' leading the Cats 9 of the past 10yrs..

bang-up job on the info :wink:


You're missing my point. Ocho isn't all that great any longer. Listing his absence as a detriment to Dalton is a bit of a stretch, imo. The Cincy receiving corps is a strength for them.
yes that point was very deep .. I had to dig tremendously then use my decoder ring.

you can have your point anyway you want.. my post was about facts not speculation.. you can have your opinion - no problem with that at all. My point that you were replying to is what it is whether or not you think its a positive for Cinci is one thing.. the fact that talent and schedule Cam had vs. Dalton's in comparison is what we're/I'm looking at.. Its grossly lopsided.

So you're of the opinion its better for a rookie QB to go into the season with a rookie WR and a 2nd yr TE along with Benson and a patch-work O-line vs Cinci's schedule than what Carolina handed Cam along with that cream-puff passing D schedule?

Ocho stinko or not - the 2x all pro wasn't even available to him. ... but yes, I saw/seen your point... respectfully - its irrelevant.

_________________
"This whole world would be successful if everybody stopped quitting." - Evander Holyfield


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 14:32 
Offline
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Sat 05.16.2009, 09:57
Posts: 27848
Sand$: 33236
Donate
Location: Arkansas
mia.gif
birddog wrote:
Elmagister wrote:
birddog wrote:
Elmagister wrote:
His former #1 is really doing a bang up job in NE.
former.. kind of a key word here. Hes a Rookie.. there is no 'his former' ..Didn't even have the opportunity to play with the guy that lead his team in receiving 7 of the past 9yrs. Like Newton having Smitty.. 'the best WR pound for pound' leading the Cats 9 of the past 10yrs..

bang-up job on the info :wink:


You're missing my point. Ocho isn't all that great any longer. Listing his absence as a detriment to Dalton is a bit of a stretch, imo. The Cincy receiving corps is a strength for them.
yes that point was very deep .. I had to dig tremendously then use my decoder ring.

you can have your point anyway you want.. my post was about facts not speculation.. you can have your opinion - no problem with that at all. My point that you were replying to is what it is whether or not you think its a positive for Cinci is one thing.. the fact that talent and schedule Cam had vs. Dalton's in comparison is what we're/I'm looking at.. Its grossly lopsided.

So you're of the opinion its better for a rookie QB to go into the season with a rookie WR and a 2nd yr TE along with Benson and a patch-work O-line vs Cinci's schedule than what Carolina handed Cam along with that cream-puff passing D schedule?

Ocho stinko or not - the 2x all pro wasn't even available to him. ... but yes, I saw/seen your point... respectfully - its irrelevant.


You're going to tell me my point is all about speculation while you tell me what might have been if Ocho had been retained in Cincinnati?

No way do I want that head-case around my rookie WR and rookie QB. His presence would have been a detriment.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 14:34 
Offline
Megalodon
Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Tue 08.26.2003, 13:03
Posts: 14536
Sand$: 37440
Donate
Location: At the bar, getting a Bell's Amber Ale
chi.gif
Elmagister wrote:
hard 10 wrote:
Simpson could develop into a good complementary receiver opposite Green, but he doesn't look like anything special.

I'm not calling Carolina's receivers great, just disagreeing that the Bengals pass-catchers should be considered a strength of the team.


Fair enough...not as though you can call them a weakness though. Strength may have been too strong a word. They're certainly serviceable.



I'd call them about average.

Sadly, I'd also consider "average" a huge step up from the giant pile of shoot the Bears have been calling a WR corps for the past 2 decades.

_________________
"If you can't spot the sucker in your first half hour at the table, then you are the sucker."
-Mike McD, Rounders


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 14:39 
Offline
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Sun 09.11.2005, 10:42
Posts: 37583
Sand$: 33956
Donate
Location: Rock Hill, SC
car.gif
birddog wrote:
pwbowen wrote:
birddog wrote:
For the record I'd take Smitty, Olsen, Shockey, Williams, Stewart over the entire Cinci supporting cast

Dalton's top reciever... a rookie :lol: and their entire RB depth chart = hill of beans in comparison to the Cats... O-lines?.... umm..

I don't necessarily like either but I respect what each kid did.



Then you have Ponder who was #1 in the league in red-zone efficiency :wink:


I'd have to consider that trade. Greisham is as good as Olsen/Shockey. Smitty only has a handful of years left so I'd take AJ Green straight up for him and Simpson>Lafell unless he goes to jail.

RBs though, Carolina>>>Cincy.

But you can't simply trade offense, let's not forget Special Teams and Defense help take more pressure off Dalton than what Newton gets.

Oh, and a much softer schedule for Cincy even with 2xBaltimore and 2xPittsburgh.

Dalton's good and I like him but he's not on the same level as Newton, no matter how many times Bradshaw wants to whine about it.


I think its more than fair to say Cam's supporting cast was 2x's better than Dalton's.. and about 4x's better than Ponder's.. easy. Consider a trade?.. this is about 2011. Vets for unproven rookies and a guy thats known for 1 play the entire year?.. a flip after the catch? then Gresham = Olsen/Sholckey?..which one?.. because its certainly not both.

you mention defense so lets take a look....

Image Image

add Newton's home game fluff pass D's vs Green Bay and Minnesota then the creature comforts of 6 Dome games compared to Dalton's mighty 1 dome game vs. Indy.. I believe the reality of schedule shows its face quite clearly. You can't design an easier schedule to pass against than what Newton got this season.. and his front office brought in 2 veteran pass catching TEs.. even traded for 1 in Olsen.. kind of a luxury having a 2x All Pro WR and 1x All Pro TE... especially with that soft schedule.

What did Cinci do for Dalton?... drafted a rookie WR and didn't re sign their former #1 2x All Pro WR..

Marvin Lewis: "Hey Red we've got a helluva schedule compared to that Newton kid so heres Cedric Benson, a rookie WR and a 2nd yr TE along with a patch-work O-line.. I expect success!"


Fluff TD's? I didn't realize that we should devalue TDs thrown in competitive games since the Green Bay and Minny D's don't meet your standards. Or are you just assuming they were garbage TD's, which they weren't?

Soft schedule? Yeah, 7 games against playoff teams (for both), that's really soft. :roll:

I'd trade the Panthers WR/TE corp for the Bengals, say what you want. Shockey's not even under contract and Smith is almost done. I think any GM in the league would take Green over Smith if they are building a team based on skill and potential and $$$ cost.

If you seriously think Dalton's as good as Newton and swapping them wouldn't have a measureable difference on their team's records then this conversation's pretty pointless.

Just curious, how many games did Dalton take his team to a lead into the 2nd half only to watch the D/special teams blow? I can tell you the number here in Carolina was 8 of the 10 losses.

_________________
34-17/ 29-7 / 34-13 / 27-17 / 31-17

2010 & 2011 Baseball National Champs

I was the smartest person I knew, certainly I had wherewithal to unravel the mysteries that lay at the heart of a moron.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 15:11 
Online
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Tue 09.06.2005, 07:51
Posts: 29566
Sand$: 115080
Donate
Location: where the red furn grows
min.gif
Elmagister wrote:
birddog wrote:
Elmagister wrote:
birddog wrote:
Elmagister wrote:
His former #1 is really doing a bang up job in NE.
former.. kind of a key word here. Hes a Rookie.. there is no 'his former' ..Didn't even have the opportunity to play with the guy that lead his team in receiving 7 of the past 9yrs. Like Newton having Smitty.. 'the best WR pound for pound' leading the Cats 9 of the past 10yrs..

bang-up job on the info :wink:


You're missing my point. Ocho isn't all that great any longer. Listing his absence as a detriment to Dalton is a bit of a stretch, imo. The Cincy receiving corps is a strength for them.
yes that point was very deep .. I had to dig tremendously then use my decoder ring.

you can have your point anyway you want.. my post was about facts not speculation.. you can have your opinion - no problem with that at all. My point that you were replying to is what it is whether or not you think its a positive for Cinci is one thing.. the fact that talent and schedule Cam had vs. Dalton's in comparison is what we're/I'm looking at.. Its grossly lopsided.

So you're of the opinion its better for a rookie QB to go into the season with a rookie WR and a 2nd yr TE along with Benson and a patch-work O-line vs Cinci's schedule than what Carolina handed Cam along with that cream-puff passing D schedule?

Ocho stinko or not - the 2x all pro wasn't even available to him. ... but yes, I saw/seen your point... respectfully - its irrelevant.


You're going to tell me my point is all about speculation while you tell me what might have been if Ocho had been retained in Cincinnati?

No way do I want that head-case around my rookie WR and rookie QB. His presence would have been a detriment.

I didn't tell you what might've been - I mentioned what didn't happen - he wasn't there... wasn't around to find out. I didn't speculate a thing.

^^^"His presence would have been a detriment." = more speculation...? :?

_________________
"This whole world would be successful if everybody stopped quitting." - Evander Holyfield


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 15:14 
Offline
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Sat 05.16.2009, 09:57
Posts: 27848
Sand$: 33236
Donate
Location: Arkansas
mia.gif
birddog wrote:
I didn't tell you what might've been - I mentioned what didn't happen - he wasn't there... wasn't around to find out. I didn't speculate a thing.

^^^"His presence would have been a detriment." = more speculation...? :?


What are you implying by pointing out that Ocho wasn't there? You can't have it both ways. You're either saying his presence would have aided Dalton, or it's irrelevant to the conversation.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 15:45 
Online
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Tue 09.06.2005, 07:51
Posts: 29566
Sand$: 115080
Donate
Location: where the red furn grows
min.gif
pwbowen wrote:
birddog wrote:
pwbowen wrote:
birddog wrote:
For the record I'd take Smitty, Olsen, Shockey, Williams, Stewart over the entire Cinci supporting cast

Dalton's top reciever... a rookie :lol: and their entire RB depth chart = hill of beans in comparison to the Cats... O-lines?.... umm..

I don't necessarily like either but I respect what each kid did.



Then you have Ponder who was #1 in the league in red-zone efficiency :wink:


I'd have to consider that trade. Greisham is as good as Olsen/Shockey. Smitty only has a handful of years left so I'd take AJ Green straight up for him and Simpson>Lafell unless he goes to jail.

RBs though, Carolina>>>Cincy.

But you can't simply trade offense, let's not forget Special Teams and Defense help take more pressure off Dalton than what Newton gets.

Oh, and a much softer schedule for Cincy even with 2xBaltimore and 2xPittsburgh.

Dalton's good and I like him but he's not on the same level as Newton, no matter how many times Bradshaw wants to whine about it.


I think its more than fair to say Cam's supporting cast was 2x's better than Dalton's.. and about 4x's better than Ponder's.. easy. Consider a trade?.. this is about 2011. Vets for unproven rookies and a guy thats known for 1 play the entire year?.. a flip after the catch? then Gresham = Olsen/Sholckey?..which one?.. because its certainly not both.

you mention defense so lets take a look....

Image Image

add Newton's home game fluff pass D's vs Green Bay and Minnesota then the creature comforts of 6 Dome games compared to Dalton's mighty 1 dome game vs. Indy.. I believe the reality of schedule shows its face quite clearly. You can't design an easier schedule to pass against than what Newton got this season.. and his front office brought in 2 veteran pass catching TEs.. even traded for 1 in Olsen.. kind of a luxury having a 2x All Pro WR and 1x All Pro TE... especially with that soft schedule.

What did Cinci do for Dalton?... drafted a rookie WR and didn't re sign their former #1 2x All Pro WR..

Marvin Lewis: "Hey Red we've got a helluva schedule compared to that Newton kid so heres Cedric Benson, a rookie WR and a 2nd yr TE along with a patch-work O-line.. I expect success!"


Fluff TD's? I didn't realize that we should devalue TDs thrown in competitive games since the Green Bay and Minny D's don't meet your standards. Or are you just assuming they were garbage TD's, which they weren't?

Soft schedule? Yeah, 7 games against playoff teams (for both), that's really soft. :roll:

I'd trade the Panthers WR/TE corp for the Bengals, say what you want. Shockey's not even under contract and Smith is almost done. I think any GM in the league would take Green over Smith if they are building a team based on skill and potential and $$$ cost.

If you seriously think Dalton's as good as Newton and swapping them wouldn't have a measureable difference on their team's records then this conversation's pretty pointless.

Just curious, how many games did Dalton take his team to a lead into the 2nd half only to watch the D/special teams blow? I can tell you the number here in Carolina was 8 of the 10 losses.

Read again.. fluff pass D's .. I suppose you could equate those to fluff pass TDs too .. I could've thrown for 300/3 against Green Bay and Minnesota - at home :wink: No secret Minnys pass-D/DBs were arguably the worst in the NFL and Green Bay's isn't/wasn't much better.

Again we're talking about this past season.. 2011. Going forward people can speculate all they want.. I like AJ Green too.. still a 2011 rookie though. Whos to say going forward the Cats don't shore it up again?

No ones swapping anything.. you're the one swapping here P.. straight up - talent for talent.. the Cats surrounded Cam with more and had a softer schedule against the pass. Proofs in the pudding.

Its not that I'm ripping on either one of 'em but eh... looking at things a little here seems to show some huge discrepancies that give this conversation a point. :wink:

_________________
"This whole world would be successful if everybody stopped quitting." - Evander Holyfield


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 15:51 
Online
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Tue 09.06.2005, 07:51
Posts: 29566
Sand$: 115080
Donate
Location: where the red furn grows
min.gif
Elmagister wrote:
birddog wrote:
I didn't tell you what might've been - I mentioned what didn't happen - he wasn't there... wasn't around to find out. I didn't speculate a thing.

^^^"His presence would have been a detriment." = more speculation...? :?


What are you implying by pointing out that Ocho wasn't there? You can't have it both ways. You're either saying his presence would have aided Dalton, or it's irrelevant to the conversation.
you have problems with comprehension. i haven't said either. They didn't re-sign the 2x all pro WR and team receiving leader in 7 of the past 9yrs. .. to quote it, "didn't re sign their former #1 2x All Pro WR.." pretty simple

_________________
"This whole world would be successful if everybody stopped quitting." - Evander Holyfield


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 15:53 
Offline
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Sat 05.16.2009, 09:57
Posts: 27848
Sand$: 33236
Donate
Location: Arkansas
mia.gif
birddog wrote:
Elmagister wrote:
birddog wrote:
I didn't tell you what might've been - I mentioned what didn't happen - he wasn't there... wasn't around to find out. I didn't speculate a thing.

^^^"His presence would have been a detriment." = more speculation...? :?


What are you implying by pointing out that Ocho wasn't there? You can't have it both ways. You're either saying his presence would have aided Dalton, or it's irrelevant to the conversation.
you have problems with comprehension. i haven't said either. They didn't re-sign the 2x all pro WR and team receiving leader in 7 of the past 9yrs. .. to quote it, "didn't re sign their former #1 2x All Pro WR.." pretty simple


My comprehension is fine. They didn't need to resign him because his play has fallen off of a cliff. If you're not implying that he would have helped, then what is your point?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 16:30 
Online
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Tue 09.06.2005, 07:51
Posts: 29566
Sand$: 115080
Donate
Location: where the red furn grows
min.gif
I don't believe it is fine.. regardless, new team.. new offense. You can draw it any way you want from there. Fine with me. 2x all pro franchise receiving leaders have -0- to offer a rookie QB. I'll remember that. thanks.

_________________
"This whole world would be successful if everybody stopped quitting." - Evander Holyfield


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 16:33 
Offline
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Sat 05.16.2009, 09:57
Posts: 27848
Sand$: 33236
Donate
Location: Arkansas
mia.gif
birddog wrote:
I don't believe it is fine.. regardless, new team.. new offense. You can draw it any way you want from there. Fine with me. 2x all pro franchise receiving leaders have -0- to offer a rookie QB. I'll remember that. thanks.


See there? Was it so hard to admit that you were speculating that Ocho would have improved Dalton's performance? I wasn't the one against speculation though, and I'm speculating that he wouldn't have helped out much on the field, and would have hurt off of it.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 17:09 
Online
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Tue 09.06.2005, 07:51
Posts: 29566
Sand$: 115080
Donate
Location: where the red furn grows
min.gif
you're reaching - I didn't speculate anything. I stated a fact - 2x all pro WR wasn't re-signed.


you on the other hand........

_________________
"This whole world would be successful if everybody stopped quitting." - Evander Holyfield


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 17:10 
Offline
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Sat 05.16.2009, 09:57
Posts: 27848
Sand$: 33236
Donate
Location: Arkansas
mia.gif
birddog wrote:
you're reaching - I didn't speculate anything. I stated a fact - 2x all pro WR wasn't re-signed.


you on the other hand........


One more time...if you aren't implying anything with that statement...it's completely irrelevant to the topic at hand. :wink:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun 01.15.2012, 17:21 
Online
Supreme Megalodon
Supreme Megalodon
User avatar

Joined: Tue 09.06.2005, 07:51
Posts: 29566
Sand$: 115080
Donate
Location: where the red furn grows
min.gif
Elmagister wrote:
birddog wrote:
you're reaching - I didn't speculate anything. I stated a fact - 2x all pro WR wasn't re-signed.


you on the other hand........


One more time...if you aren't implying anything with that statement...it's completely irrelevant to the topic at hand. :wink:


your comprehension is an anomaly - stated fact. not implication :wink:

Image

_________________
"This whole world would be successful if everybody stopped quitting." - Evander Holyfield


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 70 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: badekyle, Baron_Fel, Bing [Bot], bluemist, c2a, gballs1, Google [Bot], icemen55, jesteva, Killa CAM CAN!!, licker, lrgates20, neal123454, Sneaky and 23 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group