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There are two types of Fantasy Football Owners: Sharks and Chum, which are you?
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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:25 
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FutBol wrote:
This is the most common counterpoint brought up with this topic, and the answer is very simple. In FF, there is no such thing as resting your players. Nothing you do with your fantasy squad will have any impact on the players getting rested or avoiding injury. In the NFL, resting starters is also used as a chance to allow backup players to get game experience in the event they are needed during playoffs. This is also nothing that matches fantasy.


No but the objective is the same. They are essentially willing to provide their week 17 opponent with a win to improve their own playoff chances. The specifics are different but the underlying principles are the same.


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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:30 
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I can see why you think my statement was counter-intuitive, but the key part of that sentence is "not altered by intentional sabotage". You've gotten where you are because you picked the right players and submitted the right lineups, now let the other teams live and die by their ability to do the same.

It's weak, any way you slice it. Like I said, if I commished a league where someone did this, I wouldn't invite them back, and I wouldn't return to a league where this was permitted. It's the epitome of bush league and can destroy a league. It's on the same level as churning the WW IMO. You can make an argument of "it's no fault but their own for not having a better lineup or that they didn't draft better" for that, as well.


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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:32 
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i don't know why you think there is some magic answer. this is all opinion based. if it's not in your leagues rules then do it if it makes your day better. you can debate what everyone says, but that's because it's all opinion. any opinion can be debated. all i can say is that most of the people told you it was bad juju. you find it necessary for this to be "fact based". well it can't be. just do what you have to do and stop trying to get people to jump on your moral lowground. as i've said a couple times before, you would be removed from the league post season and i would write the rule in to place. bad sportsmanship.

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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:33 
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james10011 wrote:
FutBol wrote:
This is the most common counterpoint brought up with this topic, and the answer is very simple. In FF, there is no such thing as resting your players. Nothing you do with your fantasy squad will have any impact on the players getting rested or avoiding injury. In the NFL, resting starters is also used as a chance to allow backup players to get game experience in the event they are needed during playoffs. This is also nothing that matches fantasy.


No but the objective is the same. They are essentially willing to provide their week 17 opponent with a win to improve their own playoff chances. The specifics are different but the underlying principles are the same.

That's a huge stretch.

Do you think dyno owners should be allowed to submit tanked line-ups each week to try to battle for the 1.1 pick in rookie drafts? At some point "tanking for your team's best interest" completely kills the game.


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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:37 
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pinksheets wrote:
james10011 wrote:
FutBol wrote:
This is the most common counterpoint brought up with this topic, and the answer is very simple. In FF, there is no such thing as resting your players. Nothing you do with your fantasy squad will have any impact on the players getting rested or avoiding injury. In the NFL, resting starters is also used as a chance to allow backup players to get game experience in the event they are needed during playoffs. This is also nothing that matches fantasy.


No but the objective is the same. They are essentially willing to provide their week 17 opponent with a win to improve their own playoff chances. The specifics are different but the underlying principles are the same.

That's a huge stretch.

Do you think dyno owners should be allowed to submit tanked line-ups each week to try to battle for the 1.1 pick in rookie drafts? At some point "tanking for your team's best interest" completely kills the game.


we're beating a dead A-Hole at this point. he wants what can't be offered. he wants a fact based response to a moral question. impossible. his mind is already made up it sounds.

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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:41 
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james10011 wrote:
FutBol wrote:
This is the most common counterpoint brought up with this topic, and the answer is very simple. In FF, there is no such thing as resting your players. Nothing you do with your fantasy squad will have any impact on the players getting rested or avoiding injury. In the NFL, resting starters is also used as a chance to allow backup players to get game experience in the event they are needed during playoffs. This is also nothing that matches fantasy.


No but the objective is the same. They are essentially willing to provide their week 17 opponent with a win to improve their own playoff chances. The specifics are different but the underlying principles are the same.

The underlying principles are far from the same. The outcome is arguably similar in many cases, but one is protecting important players and getting experience for role players. It is not to intentionally lose a game. While losing may be the outcome, the backup players still play the game with the intention to win. Your intention is to lose, and there is nothing to gain for the health or experience of your team in fantasy.


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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:49 
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cowanj2005 wrote:

we're beating a dead A-Hole at this point. he wants what can't be offered. he wants a fact based response to a moral question. impossible. his mind is already made up it sounds.

this type of response is unnecessary and uncalled for.

Stating that it is a moral question means that your definition of morality is not the only one that must be accepted. Stating that it is opinion-based means everyone is entitled to their own, yet you aren't doing so.

I believe it is a combination of things and invite the discussion. Disagree if you want (as most in this thread have) but do it in a way that allows the exchange of ideas without the feeling that you have to bow to the masses.


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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:51 
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cowanj2005 wrote:
we're beating a dead A-Hole at this point. he wants what can't be offered. he wants a fact based response to a moral question. impossible. his mind is already made up it sounds.


Actually I find the conversation interesting and was hoping for some more insightful commentary and opinions. Also, how can I expect people to help me if they don't understand where I currently stand? You can feel free to piss off if you feel there's nothing to be gained here. I still hope to hear more opinions and gain more insight into the matter.

In my opinion, Fantasy football is essentially a competitive strategy game, if I were to have a strategy which will lead to improved success why shouldn't I use it? I don't understand why playing the game at a higher level is so frowned upon.

As far as teams tanking in Dyno's for a high pick. If your commissioner was too lazy to establish one of the million incentives to prevent this from happening than maybe he shouldn't be running something as sophisticated as a Dyno league.


Last edited by james10011 on Tue 11.08.2011, 21:53, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:52 
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I'd consider any team intentionally tanking a game as a violation. Period.

If it was simply this case the punishment would be non-invite back the next year.

I have no further logic and honestly I don't feel that I need it.

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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:54 
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james10011 wrote:
As far as teams tanking in Dyno's for a high pick. If your commissioner was too lazy to establish one of the million incentives to prevent this from happening than he shouldn't be running something as sophisticated as a Dyno league.


I don't have much of an issue of the initial topic, but this statement stands out to me.

It's not up to the commissioner to anticipate and plan to incentivize every owner to put their best team out there and to make the league a good league.

Owners have to take responsibility and step up and help identify and correct loopholes and issues, not simply look for things to exploit.

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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:55 
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FutBol wrote:
cowanj2005 wrote:

we're beating a dead A-Hole at this point. he wants what can't be offered. he wants a fact based response to a moral question. impossible. his mind is already made up it sounds.

this type of response is unnecessary and uncalled for.

Stating that it is a moral question means that your definition of morality is the one that must be accepted. Stating that it is opinion-based means everyone is entitled to their own, yet you aren't doing so.

I believe it is a combination of things and invite the discussion. Disagree if you want (as most in this thread have) but do it in a way that allows the exchange of ideas without the feeling that you have to bow to the masses.


if it's not in the league rules it is without a doubt a moral question. i'm not saying my morals are right and his are wrong. the problem i have is that every time someone says something he says he wants facts. there are none. everything that is going to be shared with him is based on opinion. so why ask a moral question if you want a fact based response that doesn't exist. either way, i feel bad for the guy who paid to play in a competitive league is about to get screwed by some dude who is comparing his decision to resting starters and avoiding injury in the real games.

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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 21:59 
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benching your team is not strategy... it's just lowering the competitiveness of the league. either way, i'm out. i have a feeling you posted this thinking people would agree it's a great strategy and pat you on the bad for your creativeness. it's not a new tactic and it's one solid owners avoid because it spoils good leagues.

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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 22:03 
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james10011 wrote:
As far as teams tanking in Dyno's for a high pick. If your commissioner was too lazy to establish one of the million incentives to prevent this from happening than maybe he shouldn't be running something as sophisticated as a Dyno league.

Why should their be incentives not to, though? The reason rules against that are put into place in dynasty is because losing intentionally, even if it's for what you feel is your team's best interest, is not in the best interest of the league.


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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 22:04 
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pwbowen wrote:
james10011 wrote:
As far as teams tanking in Dyno's for a high pick. If your commissioner was too lazy to establish one of the million incentives to prevent this from happening than he shouldn't be running something as sophisticated as a Dyno league.


I don't have much of an issue of the initial topic, but this statement stands out to me.

It's not up to the commissioner to anticipate and plan to incentivize every owner to put their best team out there and to make the league a good league.

Owners have to take responsibility and step up and help identify and correct loopholes and issues, not simply look for things to exploit.

I agree with this. Incentives are there as an encouragement, but it is not forcing anyone to do anything if they believe the incentive does not outweigh the perceived benefit of the behavior you are trying to prevent.

If anything, I would think there should be incentives in the league James is discussing to prevent a team from wanting to tank a game at the end. High week, season high, reg season standings, division winners, etc.


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PostPosted: Tue 11.08.2011, 22:11 
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pwbowen wrote:
james10011 wrote:
As far as teams tanking in Dyno's for a high pick. If your commissioner was too lazy to establish one of the million incentives to prevent this from happening than he shouldn't be running something as sophisticated as a Dyno league.


I don't have much of an issue of the initial topic, but this statement stands out to me.

It's not up to the commissioner to anticipate and plan to incentivize every owner to put their best team out there and to make the league a good league.

Owners have to take responsibility and step up and help identify and correct loopholes and issues, not simply look for things to exploit.


The ease with which you can prevent tanking in money-league Dyno's definitely holds the commissioner a little liable. Offer a cash incentive to the highest scoring, non-playoff team. Implement a lottery system. Penalize last place teams. Assign semi random draft order. Implement a playoff for picking order among bottom teams. Weekly high scoring, season high-scoring. That's just off the top of my head, surely a seasoned commissioner has many more valid ways to keep everyone properly motivated late in the season.


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