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birddog wrote:
jamcutpost wrote:
birddog wrote:My .02

Mayock >>>>>> Ozzie Newsome

Every day.


Hope so.

As a 3rd party id love for them to knock it OOTP.

Ill admit, im v.v. sceptical - but id love to be dead wrong. Fans deserve a break.

Only person I've respected year-in-year-out over the past 10 or so..

Realize before you criticize.


Mayock?

He’s just been a talking head with zero accountability

Why do you respect him so much?
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He respects the craft of hot take, not so much Mayock. Mayock is just the delivery vehicle.
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hawkdogger wrote:
birddog wrote:
jamcutpost wrote:quote="birddog"
My .02

Mayock >>>>>> Ozzie Newsome

Every day.
/quote


Hope so.

As a 3rd party id love for them to knock it OOTP.

Ill admit, im v.v. sceptical - but id love to be dead wrong. Fans deserve a break.

Only person I've respected year-in-year-out over the past 10 or so..

Realize before you criticize.


Mayock?

He’s just been a talking head with zero accountability

Why do you respect him so much?


Only person I've ever looked forward to hearing their rankings for years... Years. Hes been getting a little bit too E$PNish the past few regardless but thats the animal we're chasing with this unicorn and rainbow show.

Also, he got hooked up with the Vikes some years ago and started doing stuff from camps through preseason before and into his ND gig and I liked what he had to say through that time even if I didn't agree with it or saw it differently. Never once did he hook his wagon to the company mule that I recall.

I believe hes going to do a solid job at this even though its all a pony show. Its comical hearing people bang on him.. its as if they know better.
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Guess we’ll have to revisit this once Mayock drafts multiple hall of famers and builds two separate Super Bowl champion teams.

Mayock was my favorite analyst (but he never got hooked up with the Jets) so who knows if that translates to being one of the greatest general managers ever. I’d lean no but let’s see.

Facts > Emotion
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birddog wrote:slurpees gonna slurp

On schedule
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endzoneview wrote:Guess we’ll have to revisit this once Mayock drafts multiple hall of famers and builds two separate Super Bowl champion teams.

Facts > Emotion



Such an interesting question, regarding how to view a GM.

On the one hand, I can see a valid argument that Baltimore was consistently good not great, and since he became GM in November of 2002, the Ravens made the playoffs 9 times out of 16 seasons (2003-2018), with 6 of those teams losing in the wild card or divisional round. More importantly, they only won their division 5 times in those 16 years.

That said, they were consistently good (only 3 seasons below 8-8), were always filled with talent, and had a very strong run between 2008-2012 (Harbaugh was hired in 2008), where they went 11-5, 9-7, 12-4, 12-4, 10-6, made the playoffs every year, went to the AFC Championship 3 times and finally won the Super Bowl in 2012.

Especially when you add in his scouting before becoming GM (BAL won the Super Bowl in 2000 using several players Newsome scouted), I think he was one of the best GMs for that time period. Not sure why anyone is knocking him.
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I'll also note that since 2000, only four teams have won 2+ Super Bowls -- New England (6), NYG (2007 and 2011), PIT (2005 and 2008), and BAL (2000 and 2012).

That shows how fickle the league is, especially how random winning the Super Bowl can be. Using overall wins as a benchmark, the Ravens are 5th in the league since 2000 with 164 (counting playoffs, 7th without playoffs, as PHI and DEN leapfrog):

1) NE 209 (22 playoff)
2) IND 180 (12 playoff)
3) PIT 177 (13 playoff)
4) GB 171 (11 playoff)
5) BAL 164 (15 playoff)
6) PHI 162 (10 playoff)
7) DEN 159 (6 playoff)
8) SEA 155 (13 playoff)
9) NO 146 (7 playoff)
10) NYG 145 (10 playoff)

https://www.baltimorebeatdown.com/2016/ ... super-bowl
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He's a HoF GM.
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The Ravens success despite a large portion of their cap being eaten by an extremely mediocre QB should says all it needs to about his team building abilities. And, no, not retaining Flacco was never an option. The optics behind not bringing back a super bowl winner the year after you offered him a more market friendly deal then told him if you're really that good then go win then come back to this table next year...then not re-signing him anyway. You can't do that. No owner would sign off on that. So don't even think about trying.
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Cyguy84 wrote:
endzoneview wrote:Guess we’ll have to revisit this once Mayock drafts multiple hall of famers and builds two separate Super Bowl champion teams.

Facts > Emotion



Such an interesting question, regarding how to view a GM.

On the one hand, I can see a valid argument that Baltimore was consistently good not great, and since he became GM in November of 2002, the Ravens made the playoffs 9 times out of 16 seasons (2003-2018), with 6 of those teams losing in the wild card or divisional round. More importantly, they only won their division 5 times in those 16 years.

That said, they were consistently good (only 3 seasons below 8-8), were always filled with talent, and had a very strong run between 2008-2012 (Harbaugh was hired in 2008), where they went 11-5, 9-7, 12-4, 12-4, 10-6, made the playoffs every year, went to the AFC Championship 3 times and finally won the Super Bowl in 2012.

Especially when you add in his scouting before becoming GM (BAL won the Super Bowl in 2000 using several players Newsome scouted), I think he was one of the best GMs for that time period. Not sure why anyone is knocking him.


Just to note, while he was named GM in 2002 there wasn’t a previous GM. He was the VP of Player Personnel and functioned as a GM but the Modell/Ravens power structure didn’t have a “GM”. He built that 2000 team as well as the 2012 SB winning team with completely different players and coaching staffs. (other than Ray Lewis who is the only player on both teams which is amazing in his own right)
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endzoneview wrote:
Cyguy84 wrote:
endzoneview wrote:Guess we’ll have to revisit this once Mayock drafts multiple hall of famers and builds two separate Super Bowl champion teams.

Facts > Emotion



Such an interesting question, regarding how to view a GM.

On the one hand, I can see a valid argument that Baltimore was consistently good not great, and since he became GM in November of 2002, the Ravens made the playoffs 9 times out of 16 seasons (2003-2018), with 6 of those teams losing in the wild card or divisional round. More importantly, they only won their division 5 times in those 16 years.

That said, they were consistently good (only 3 seasons below 8-8), were always filled with talent, and had a very strong run between 2008-2012 (Harbaugh was hired in 2008), where they went 11-5, 9-7, 12-4, 12-4, 10-6, made the playoffs every year, went to the AFC Championship 3 times and finally won the Super Bowl in 2012.

Especially when you add in his scouting before becoming GM (BAL won the Super Bowl in 2000 using several players Newsome scouted), I think he was one of the best GMs for that time period. Not sure why anyone is knocking him.


Just to note, while he was named GM in 2002 there wasn’t a previous GM. He was the VP of Player Personnel and functioned as a GM but the Modell/Ravens power structure didn’t have a “GM”. He built that 2000 team as well as the 2012 SB winning team with completely different players and coaching staffs. (other than Ray Lewis who is the only player on both teams which is amazing in his own right)


I think I did him a favor by not giving him GM credit, but mentioning that he scouted that SB team. From 1996-2002, BAL had two good seasons and the rest were mediocre. But good with the bad, he gets credit for building the 2000 SB Champion.
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As a season ticket holder back then, let me tell you, I have seen plenty of poor QB play (combined with being a Jets fan, it’s been a god damn travesty). So if we want to knock Ozzie, it will be at QB. Joe Flacco is the greatest in Ravens history which says everything.

Going completely off memory, here is the horrible list -

Vinny (ok, not that bad)
Tony Banks
Trent Dilfer (of course)
Stoney Case
Elvis Grbac
Eric Zeier
Jeff Blake
Chris Redman

I’m probably blocking out a few. I think Stoney Case actually was named starter prior to Week 1 one year. Terrible. But, I also witnessed some of the greatest defense ever played.
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I had to look it up, Scott Mitchell was named the starter in 99 and lasted 1-1/2 games. Stony Case was the backup and started for a month before Tony Banks took over.

I forgot Jim Harbaugh started a season as well.
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endzoneview wrote:As a season ticket holder back then, let me tell you, I have seen plenty of poor QB play (combined with being a Jets fan, it’s been a god damn travesty). So if we want to knock Ozzie, it will be at QB. Joe Flacco is the greatest in Ravens history which says everything.

Going completely off memory, here is the horrible list -

Vinny (ok, not that bad)
Tony Banks
Trent Dilfer (of course)
Stoney Case
Elvis Grbac
Eric Zeier
Jeff Blake
Chris Redman

I’m probably blocking out a few. I think Stoney Case actually was named starter prior to Week 1 one year. Terrible. But, I also witnessed some of the greatest defense ever played.


If we're talking about blindspots for Ozzie?

QB has (as well explained by EZ) to be one, but WR is up there too.

Out of his 26 draft picks at the spot? Theres only 2 guys who were actually "successful": Torrey & Clayton (and even Clayton only went over 550yds twice!)

Even his FA WRs have been more miss than hit. Boldin & Smith is your lot there. And TBF i give no one credit for rostering Boldin & Smiffy. Thats a no brainer.
Last edited by jamcutpost on Mon 04.15.2019, 17:35, edited 1 time in total.
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sure but look who was throwing to them :wink: