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jamcutpost wrote:
zuggyawesome wrote:I didn't say that Cohen should get more touches. I'm saying the only reason he's not a workhorse is because his body can't handle it. Why does it make sense to lighten his workload when his RB touches will very likely be far more efficient than Monty's?


Based on ... What, exactly? :-k


Probably based off of how efficient Cohens touches were already.

Now, quibble words like 'far more' leave a lot to how one wants to argue either side of it.

But Cohen in 2 seasons has a 4.4 ypc and a 8.7ypr. Do you think Montgomery is going to to better than either of those with more touches? Cohen only averages about 6 rushes per game and around 5 targets per game anyway. I could see those going up personally.
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ubertaco wrote:
jamcutpost wrote:
zuggyawesome wrote:I didn't say that Cohen should get more touches. I'm saying the only reason he's not a workhorse is because his body can't handle it. Why does it make sense to lighten his workload when his RB touches will very likely be far more efficient than Monty's?


Based on ... What, exactly? :-k


Probably based off of how efficient Cohens touches were already.

Now, quibble words like 'far more' leave a lot to how one wants to argue either side of it.

But Cohen in 2 seasons has a 4.4 ypc and a 8.7ypr. Do you think Montgomery is going to to better than either of those with more touches? Cohen only averages about 6 rushes per game and around 5 targets per game anyway. I could see those going up personally.


Exactly.

Per PFF-

Cohen is a threat out of the backfield in the passing game. In order to improve his quarterback’s efficiency, he should be looked at early and often this season. He finished fourth among running backs by combining for 30 first downs and touchdowns through the air. He averaged 7.6 yards after the catch and forced 16 missed tackles on 71 receptions. With rookie David Montgomery the likely team leader in carries, Cohen’s best usage should come via the passing game, which should help Trubisky.

Finishing as the second-most valuable running back per PFF’s WAR metric, Cohen is a prime example of an NFL back with high-end successes across nearly all of our advanced receiving stats. He led all qualifying backs in yards per route run (2.37), logged just one drop and recorded an impressive 111.0 passer rating when targeted.


Highly unlikely any RB in this draft class sniffs anywhere close to that level of efficiency in the passing game.
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No doubt Cohen is dynamic, and can makes some things out of nothing, or at least a bit more out of very little.

That being said, a lot of what he was involved in was "special" stuff. Nagy's bag of tricks, which would tend to lend themselves to some confusion and bigger things potentially breaking open.

Unfortunately your every down, or nearly every down back doesn't have this luxury, and you just have to take what you can get more often than not.

I think a lot of what is stated above is a result of this. Otherwise said, Cohen's touches go up; his average production will go down. When Cohen got the ball straight up out of the backfield, more often than not he got blasted.
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Cohens touches going up doesn't mean going up by 10 per game. It means going up by 2 or so. At least to me.

However you want to look at him he was very effective, and that's all that ultimately matters. The point here isn't to ring Cohens bell anyway, it's to suggest that Montgomery may not be in line to get all of the touches Howard got last year. That's still not a knock on Montgomery, he will get a good share of touches I think, just not at the expense of Cohen.
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I expect him to get Howard's touches and more.
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ubertaco wrote:Cohens touches going up doesn't mean going up by 10 per game. It means going up by 2 or so. At least to me.

However you want to look at him he was very effective, and that's all that ultimately matters. The point here isn't to ring Cohens bell anyway, it's to suggest that Montgomery may not be in line to get all of the touches Howard got last year. That's still not a knock on Montgomery, he will get a good share of touches I think, just not at the expense of Cohen.


I don't expect Cohen's touches to go up, just to remain static. The guy is extremely small, and while giving him a bigger workload would likely improve the efficiency of the offense it would vastly increase the chance Cohen gets injured.

Elmagister wrote:I expect him to get Howard's touches and more.


I think Mike Davis is going to take a larger piece of the pie than people realize. One of the reasons that Howard dominated the rushing pool so much last season was his lack of competition. Benny Cunningham (who had all of 11 rushing attempts all year) was who he was competing touches with, and I think it's fairly safe to say that Mike Davis is a significant upgrade over him, and the team invested significant cap room to bring him in... he also started the game and has been talked up repeatedly this offseason by the Bears coaching staff.
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I think people overrate Mike Davis.
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Elmagister wrote:I think people overrate Mike Davis.


You think he's better or worse than Benny Cunningham? :-k
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Cunningham is the better receiver.
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Elmagister wrote:Cunningham is the better receiver.


:lol: no way, Davis has been a good receiver dating back to college... and Monty's biggest competition for targets was always Cohen anyway.
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I didn't say Davis wasn't a good receiver.
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Elmagister wrote:I didn't say Davis wasn't a good receiver.


I'm saying there is nothing pointing at Cunningham from college or the pro's that says he's a better receiver.
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zuggyawesome wrote:
Elmagister wrote:I didn't say Davis wasn't a good receiver.


I'm saying there is nothing pointing at Cunningham from college or the pro's that says he's a better receiver.

Well, Benny's about to age/wash out of the league, but when he was with the Rams and used as a receiver, he caught 93 of 119 targets for 752 yards 8.1 ypr. Davis' career = 59 receptions on 78 targets for 408 yards and 6.9 ypr.

I'd say they're pretty similar. Especially in that they are career 3rd string backs.
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Elmagister wrote:
zuggyawesome wrote:
Elmagister wrote:I didn't say Davis wasn't a good receiver.


I'm saying there is nothing pointing at Cunningham from college or the pro's that says he's a better receiver.

Well, Benny's about to age/wash out of the league, but when he was with the Rams and used as a receiver, he caught 93 of 119 targets for 752 yards 8.1 ypr. Davis' career = 59 receptions on 78 targets for 408 yards and 6.9 ypr.

I'd say they're pretty similar. Especially in that they are career 3rd string backs.


Similar, sure. But I have a hard time definitively saying Cunningham is better than Mike Davis at anything. Davis's 11% target share in college is near the 80th percentile.
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