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OarChambo wrote:
sctroyfan wrote:Not sure how many "foundation" pieces are needed or even realistically attainable, financially or otherwise.. Derwin is an absolute game changer and he alone would have changed the entire complexion. Engram opposite Bosa is very solid but again injured. The D had some solid complementary players but injuries just ravaged them the last few seasons. Which obviously shined light on their depth issues but in some cases they've had to go deep into the roster for fillins it's been so bad.

I almost hate bringing up injuries though because each and every team struggles with that issue. They have been a bit unluckier than many though.. Remove players Ingram and James' caliber from any roster and there are going to be issues

:thumbright:

Stars matter. And so does depth. Studs and scrubs rarely works and when it does it's usually a one-off sorta thing, like Jacksonville when they made that AFCCG run. Enhanced ability to acquire both is why I think the Jags situation is more attractive - their core is younger, they have $35m more available to spend, and they have have 5 picks in the top 75 compared to 3. For me, there's only one reason the Chargers job would be better - if my assessment is that Herbert is substantially better than every non-Lawrence QB in the 21 draft.


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I don't agree with that. Good management teams are adept at maximizing value out of their scarce resources - and the more of them they have the better. Fear of the unknown ain't a trait I'm interested in when it comes to my team's leadership. Assess the talent available then make informed decisions.
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In terms of Qb I will agree to disagree. It's a crapshoot at best whether one develops and to already have one in place is a huge advantage..
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sctroyfan wrote:In terms of Qb I will agree to disagree. It's a crapshoot at best whether one develops and to already have one in place is a huge advantage..

From our perspective? I agree, our access to information is limited so we're tasked with making uninformed decisions. From a team's perspective I don't anymore. Their access to information is not limited - they have the ability to make informed decisions within an organizational framework they control. The expectation is for them to get it right.

Probably a better subject to dissect in winter/spring in a different thread though.
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OarChambo wrote:
sctroyfan wrote:In terms of Qb I will agree to disagree. It's a crapshoot at best whether one develops and to already have one in place is a huge advantage..

From our perspective? I agree, our access to information is limited so we're tasked with making uninformed decisions. From a team's perspective I don't anymore. Their access to information is not limited - they have the ability to make informed decisions within an organizational framework they control. The expectation is for them to get it right.

Probably a better subject to dissect in winter/spring in a different thread though.


I'm just saying that for every 1 joe burrow there are 5-6 lockers, mariotas, Rosens, Bortles, manziels ( not to get personal ) etc..

Now, no state income tax is a nice selling point!
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sctroyfan wrote:
OarChambo wrote:
sctroyfan wrote:In terms of Qb I will agree to disagree. It's a crapshoot at best whether one develops and to already have one in place is a huge advantage..

From our perspective? I agree, our access to information is limited so we're tasked with making uninformed decisions. From a team's perspective I don't anymore. Their access to information is not limited - they have the ability to make informed decisions within an organizational framework they control. The expectation is for them to get it right.

Probably a better subject to dissect in winter/spring in a different thread though.


I'm just saying that for every 1 joe burrow there are 5-6 lockers, mariotas, Rosens, Bortles, manziels ( not to get personal ) etc..

Now, no state income tax is a nice selling point!


Yup.. 20% in Cali gone in taxes? vs 0% in Florida? i'll take Fl.

With the bolts, you are playing behind the Chiefs. AFC south? I think the Jags could hang in that division with some pieces but the Bolts aren't going to catch the Chiefs anytime sorta kinda soon.
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SJSwarm wrote:
getdownmmmkay wrote:both the jags and bolts jobs are lip smacking if you're a potential HC hire. you can debate either as better than the other, but both are dream set ups for a new staff.


Unless you are in love with one of the QB’s in this draft, I don’t see how Jax can possibly be as appealing as LAC.
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Lol, ok ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Zac Taylor has it good. He coaches for one of the least-visible teams in the NFL. The Bengals don’t get much national attention, even in their good years. Taylor could be the worst coach in the history of the NFL and very few people would even notice because he’s the head coach of a team that struggles to even promote its own players.

Taylor may not be the worst coach in NFL history, but he has gotten off to an impressively bad start with the Bengals. He has coached 29 games in the NFL and won just four of them. Four!

Let that sink in. If Taylor coached for any other franchise in the NFL, people would be making a bigger deal about this. People were, deservedly, cracking jokes at Adam Gase’s Jets last year and they went 7-9! This is not meant to defend Gase, who is heading towards the third 0-16 season in NFL history, but he’s lost 13 straight regular season games and still has three more wins than Taylor does over the last two seasons.

Now, Taylor’s record is not quite as bad as it seems. Yes, he does have four wins over a 29 game stretch, but he actually does not have 25 losses. He has 24! The Bengals tied the Eagles this year, 23-23, in a woeful game.

A 4-24-1 record is barely making a blip on the national radar. Hue Jackson went 1-31 over his first two seasons with the Browns and he had the whole world laughing at him. Taylor isn’t that far off as things stand right now.

To be fair to Taylor, he has been dealt somewhat of an unlucky hand. The Bengals have been unable to field an NFL-caliber offensive line during his tenure and he’s been forced to power through a revolving door at quarterback. Andy Dalton and Ryan Finley took turns playing ineffective football last season and first-overall pick Joe Burrow suffered a season-ending knee injury after a promising start to his NFL career.

Generating offense without a quarterback is undoubtedly tough, but for a coach who was brought to the Bengals specifically to fix the offense, its struggles are even more harrowing. Cincinnati is 31st in yards per play on offense this year averaging a paltry 4.8. Last season, the Bengals averaged 4.9 yards per play, good for 29th.

According to Ben Baldwin of The Athletic, the Bengals rank 26th in expected points added per play this year (-0.042) and ranked 29th (-0.096) in 2019. That’s bad, in my professional opinion.

No matter how you slice it, Taylor hasn’t done what he’s been brought in to do. It’s not all his fault, but the Bengals have looked so lifeless and dreary under his command that no one would fault them if they moved on this offseason. Even Taylor’s hiring felt uninspired at the time. It was like a Nathan For You sketch where Nathan Fielder tries to help a random man become the head coach of an NFL team.

The Plan: Simply stand near Sean McVay to convince an NFL team you’re a genius.

Of course, no one would blame them if they kept Taylor, either, because at the end of the day, nobody outside of Cincinnati really cares about or pays attention to the Bengals.


https://ftw.usatoday.com/lists/chargers-falcons-nfl-week-14-giants-daniel-jones-chase-young-zac-taylor
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lions hired chris spielman into a FO position. he'll be involved in the interview and hiring process for both GC and HC.

...and i'm really really really happy right now. wiping a couple tears from my eyes and looking at the tony holm-signed chris spielman trading card at my work desk all:

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Hmm, strange decision. The GM looked to have been doing a pretty good job. Team is on an upward's trajectory, the issue is Bridgewater is 0-7 on game winning drives this year. They're in the perfect situation to draft a QB in what appears to be a deep QB class (and PJ Walker looked pretty good in his lone start).
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zuggyawesome wrote:Hmm, strange decision. The GM looked to have been doing a pretty good job. Team is on an upward's trajectory, the issue is Bridgewater is 0-7 on game winning drives this year. They're in the perfect situation to draft a QB in what appears to be a deep QB class (and PJ Walker looked pretty good in his lone start).


Might be a power struggle of sorts.

Rhule might've told owner I want Bridgewater out. Hurney might've said it's fine we're not drafting a QB next year.


The Bridgewater experiment needed to be done (though, the Panthers waaaaay overpaid), but it's clear now he's not the face for this franchise for what Rhule wants to do.

If the GM doesn't want to move on from a failed experiment the GM needs to go.

Ryan Fitzpatrick would've gotten them the same performance for cheaper.

Interesting quote:

Panthers owner David Tepper said that after recent conversations with Hurney about the structure of the team's football operations, it became clear they had some different ideas. Tepper was careful to say he respected Hurney's traditional approach but hopes to blend more of a data-driven process into the football operation.

.....

Tepper said Rhule would also be a participant in the GM search.

"You look at successful organizations, and there's a certain alignment between the head coach and the GM," Tepper said. "To think that you can do that without some sort of alignment is nuts. So to not have a head coach with some input into that is stupid. I don't want to be stupid, OK?"


So it sounds like Rhule and Hurney weren't on the same page.
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I think rhule just lucky he has/had these cards in his back pocket to play. I think he just as responsible for teddy being there as the gm. I think the contract isn’t great , but it isn’t terrible they can get out after next year and it’s below average salary wise.
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jnadke wrote:
zuggyawesome wrote:Hmm, strange decision. The GM looked to have been doing a pretty good job. Team is on an upward's trajectory, the issue is Bridgewater is 0-7 on game winning drives this year. They're in the perfect situation to draft a QB in what appears to be a deep QB class (and PJ Walker looked pretty good in his lone start).


Might be a power struggle of sorts.

Rhule might've told owner I want Bridgewater out. Hurney might've said it's fine we're not drafting a QB next year.


The Bridgewater experiment needed to be done (though, the Panthers waaaaay overpaid), but it's clear now he's not the face for this franchise for what Rhule wants to do.

If the GM doesn't want to move on from a failed experiment the GM needs to go.

Ryan Fitzpatrick would've gotten them the same performance for cheaper.

Interesting quote:

Panthers owner David Tepper said that after recent conversations with Hurney about the structure of the team's football operations, it became clear they had some different ideas. Tepper was careful to say he respected Hurney's traditional approach but hopes to blend more of a data-driven process into the football operation.

.....

Tepper said Rhule would also be a participant in the GM search.

"You look at successful organizations, and there's a certain alignment between the head coach and the GM," Tepper said. "To think that you can do that without some sort of alignment is nuts. So to not have a head coach with some input into that is stupid. I don't want to be stupid, OK?"


So it sounds like Rhule and Hurney weren't on the same page.


That would make a lot of sense.. still feels like he's being scapegoated. Sure, his record is bad.. but that's because they were starting Kyle Allen and Teddy Bridgewater at QB, the personnel is there to take off with a solid QB. I also really liked the PJ Walker signing, brought in an incredibly cheap, solid developmental backup (PJ Walker) who looked electric in his lone start.

I can see how diverging philosophies at the most important position in football could cause this, though.

Side note: I really want to see PJ Walker given a chance to finish out the season.. He just opens up so much more of that offense even if he made a few boneheaded redzone INTs.
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